Arcade Arms 3 - The Hero's Bow from Legend of Zelda

alanalmeriaalanalmeria Member, Moderator
edited June 2014 in Arcade Arms

So we're three episodes into the season now, and I have to wonder are there no weaponsmiths in the southern half of North America? So far poor Nika has been freezing her ears off in snow every week. Maybe episode 4 will take her to Florida or California, for a little sun, sand and destruction.

Still, the bow made for a nice change of pace this week as it gave us a entirely new "forging" process. Not to mention some really cool slow-mo images. Though the evil part of me kind of wishes they'd tried to make the boomerang. A top heavy throwing weapon would be an absolute nightmare to use in reality :-)

 Also I can't help noticing that despite its "power" the range on the Hero's bow doesn't seem to be too great.

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Comments

  • Maybe in a future episode she'll work with Sword and the Stone. They're in Burbank, CA, and do a similar YouTube show, and they've teamed up with other YouTubers before.
  • I saw a comment on the video that this was the final episode! What? Only 3? Yes, I realise that they're probably fairly expensive to make, considering the sourcing, the crafting and getting the experts in to do the smashing too, but I would definitely hope for at least a few more.
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  • alanalmeriaalanalmeria Member, Moderator
    edited June 2014 PM

    @Molokov Whilst I'm not sure Random Encounters have the inside track into G&S scheduling - and you know how easily internet rumors start :-). I wouldn't be that surprised if we only get 3-4 episodes of the show*. With the YT funding gone, it makes sense for G&S to test the waters in terms of view counts/ad revenue/sponsor interest before proceeding with a longer run, especially given the time and travel elements of a show like this.

    (*Personally I was expecting 4, the same as Unplugged got.)

    The worry is that even if the show is successful, the short run might dissuade first time viewers from subscribing to G&S, and there are times when I wonder how many of the people clamoring for more Spellslingers are actual subscribers, and how may would be if it had a Tabletop type schedule?

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  • @alanalmeria Yeah, the speculation about number of episodes isn't good - if they're up front about it (in all the pre-show publicity) then we wouldn't be worried there'd be so few. We knew in advance that there'd only be 8 episodes of Caper and 4 episodes of Spooked so there'll be no surprise when it's over.

    But Arcade Arms and Unplugged felt like slightly more expensive versions of the other main channel shows: Co-optitude (which seems to have no end), and Talkin' Comics Weekly (which got I think 12 episodes for the first 'season') so it's kind of disappointing that they can only afford to make 4 of each.
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  • alanalmeriaalanalmeria Member, Moderator
    edited June 2014 PM

    @Molokov, that's actually a really good point. Why don't they tell us the season length in advance?  I can't initially see any harm in it, unless they worry that knowing its only a short run will prevent people from giving it a try?

    On reflection its pretty hard to see the future for this subset of shows. They don't get the viewership of the more simple lets plays type shows, and they don't have the media/platform reach of the traditional scripted series. (Spooked and Caper have both had Hulu exposure, something shows like AArms don't get.) Maybe these types of things remain destined to stay on cheaper more focused channels (such as the numerous ones linked to over the thread for episode 2.)

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  • Daniel_WallaceDaniel_Wallace Member, Moderator
    edited June 2014 PM
    I felt pretty let down by this episode, I have to say.

    The bow making process was interesting even though I didn't like the amount of mystery the maker invoked and some other minor things.

    The thing I really had a problem with is the testing part. I liked the comparison between the "fantasy bow" and the "real" ones as well as the explanations for the different shooting styles. I would have liked a little more of that in the other episodes.

    But then... so, the bow is really strong and the expert suspects it is "armor piercing". Then, the arrows hardly go into the wooden targets. I would suspect that most kinds of armor are a little stronger then an oriented strand board. Were they using dull points for safety reasons or was that steel enforced OSB or was the bow not so strong in the end? At that point, I felt a little fooled.

    The part that came then angered me. @farlander, you wondered in the comments why Nika was so comfortable with the "exploding arrows"... well, because there are not exploding arrows in this show whatsoever. That whole part was very obviously faked, if you know what to look for. Watch the slow motion of the exploding pots. The explosion goes off when the arrow hits-ish but it does not spread out from the arrowhead but quite obviously from inside the pots. Nice touch with the gasoline and the sparkles... kind of.

    I do understand why they did that. Shooting "exploding arrows" would be an extremely stupid thing to do because it really is at least as dangerous to you as it is to the enemy. Also, with any reasonable amount of explosives, the viewable explosion and the visible amount of damage would be pretty underwelming for most viewers.

    So, yes, I understand that. But I still feel betrayed. As I said previously: I want to learn stuff when I watch this kind of show. When things get faked without stating it, that goes out the window. You explained that someone in a heavy suit of armor cannot do a "jump attack"* in episode two. Why not do something like that here?

    Oh, and I just read the stuff @Zuffy posted and the comments he linked too. So they also fudged up the technicalities of the bow. Now I'm angry. I'll better post this before I get rude.

    *Also, a "jump attack" is a really bad idea by itself... just to mention that.
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  • @Zuffy

    Whether an arrow will pierce a piece of armour (or more generally, whether an impactor will penetrate a thin plate) will depend on:
    1. the energy carried by the arrow;
    2. the speed of the arrow relative to the propagation speed of transverse (going perpendicular to the material of the armour) waves in the armour;
    3. the shape of the arrowhead;
    4. whether the arrow absorbs any of the energy of the impact (by breaking or deforming);
    5. the material properties of the armour

    The energy and the speed of the arrow are linked, as nearly all the energy will be kinetic energy, so faster arrow = more energy.

    The amount of energy you put in to the arrow when you fire will depend on the draw strength of the bow; but the amount of energy the arrow still has when it hits the armour will then depend on the range and the drag on the arrow. The longer the range and the higher the drag, the slower and less energetic the arrow will become.

    tl;dr: Draw strength is only one of many parameters determining if an arrow will pierce armour.
  • OakspoorOakspoor Member, Moderator
    Is everyone forgetting that rate of fire was most important to medieval bowmen. 2,000 bows releasing 8 shafts per minute is a pretty formidable atack when knights were on horses. down one horse and chances are at least one other will falter, vear or stumble. and a metal clad knight on the ground is pretty easy pickings until he can get up again.

    Bowmen would need to sustain a high rate of fire for several minutes. Sure, its nice to think of taking out a knight with one shot, but it's more realistic to get him afoot.
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  • OakspoorOakspoor Member, Moderator
    edited June 2014 PM
    This video discusses strategy and tactics using the longbow.
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  • @Zuffy I'm not sure exactly what determines the transversal wave velocity, but I would guess it's dependant on the density / atomic weight of the material and the stiffness (either Young's or shear modulus). More on that here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shear_wave.

    Why it's important is the following:
    Imagine an impactor coming in perpendicular to a plate and travelling with V1.  As the impactor hits the plate, it will deform the plate by bending it out of plane, creating a triangle shape (assuming a relatively sharp impactor). At a certain time T after the impact, the height of the triangle will be V1*T (neglecting slowing of the impactor for simplicity).

    The deformation caused by the impact will cause a transverse wave, propagating outwards from the point of impact with the transverse wave velocity V2. Any point on the material that has not yet been reached by the wave does not yet 'know' about the impact and so does not yet deform. Basically if the wave has not propagated past a certain point (yet), that point on the material is not involved in the impact process (yet).

    Thus the length of the  base of the triangle caused by the impactor is 2*V2*T (wave propagates in both directions from the point of impact). So the higher V1 and the lower V2 the steeper the triangle and the less material there is available to absorb the energy of the impact. If the impact carries more energy than the 'active' material can absorb, the plate will rupture and the impactor will penetrate.

    Regarding the 'less is more' energy question; more energy is always better. However the slower your impact speed, the larger the area you will be distributing the energy over. So if you hit something with a very high speed you'll punch straight through and leave only a small hole, whereas if you hit at a slower speed you might cause large deformations.

  • @Zuffy Yep, pretty much, the smaller the area you are spreading your energy across, the less energy you need to get it to fail (since the energy required per area is more or less constant).
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